In this episode, Jason Niedle interviews Robin Bonduelle, co-founder and CEO of Claap, discussing the lessons learned from a significant business pivot, the importance of creating a unique category in the market, and how AI can enhance sales processes and customer insights. Robin shares insights on navigating growth challenges, leveraging product-led growth strategies, and the transformative potential of AI in business operations. The conversation emphasizes the need for clear messaging and positioning, as well as the importance of understanding customer needs to drive effective solutions.
Takeaways
- Creating a new category can differentiate your business.
- Framing the problem and solution is crucial for success.
- A pivot can lead to a stronger business model.
- AI can provide actionable insights from customer conversations.
- Consistency in messaging across teams is essential.
- Product-led growth can attract users effectively.
- Understanding customer pain points is key to product development.
- AI’s impact on business will be transformative.
- Context is necessary for AI to function effectively.
- Firing yourself from roles can help identify bottlenecks.
Sound Bites
“It’s all about finding your point of view.”
“We wanted to create a more repeatable business.”
“It’s about balance; don’t reinvent the wheel.”
BeyondSaaS Transcript
Jason Niedle (00:00)
Today we’re talking with Robin Bonduelle, co-founder and CEO of Claap, about lessons learned from a big pivot, as well as automating our repetitive tasks so we can focus on what we do best.
Welcome to Beyond SaaS. I’m Jason Niedle, founder of Tethos.
Today I’m really excited to explore tech company growth with Robin. He co-founded and is currently the CEO of Claap and Claap offers a coordinated team of AI agents that handle the sales busy work so that your sales team can spend more time building out real relationships and closing faster.
And this includes a lot of cool features, note templates and automations to your stack and an AI co-pilot and CRM syncing and coaching and deal insights and follow-up emails and transcript search and onboarding. And it looks really pretty amazing. And it relieves the admin tasks from your sales team. So again, they can do what they do best. I also hear Robin that you are a sponsored endurance athlete, which makes sense kind of with his fail fast and learn faster mindset. So I’m excited to have you here. Welcome, Robin.
Robin (01:02)
Really nice to meet you, thanks for the invite.
Jason Niedle (01:04)
and thanks for coming out later at night from France i appreciate that
Hey, before we jump in, do you have a quick tip for our listeners?
Robin (01:10)
Yeah, I think I have like two really good books that have been helping me from day one. The first one is actually Play Bigger. Your audience might already know about them, like it’s the marketing pirates, they call themselves like this. And the idea is how you craft your own category instead of just like trying to be one more player on the same market.
It’s how you can frame a problem. And when people understand how you frame the problem and understand the problem, then they identify you to bring the solution. And so it’s really about how you can build a new category, how companies like Uber and Airbnb started a new category, and how you can try to do it when you create your own venture. The second one maybe is more operational, I would say. But when I started the company, I was
in product management for the past 15 years. So I had like leadership positions before, but not CEO and executive positions. And so it’s The Great CEO Within, which is another book. And it really brings like great, yeah, like learnings about how you can define, a culture that is efficient.
So organization, cultural operations to really make the company ready to scale and to be efficient. So these two books, like how to create and position yourself within a good category and how to operate your company as a CEO were really helpful to me.
Jason Niedle (02:32)
Those are great. And tell us the two titles again real fast. Play bigger.
Robin (02:34)
Yeah, Play Bigger for the marketing
one and The Great CEO Within for the kind of CEO.
Jason Niedle (02:40)
And the Great CEO Within. I always think
this idea of creating a category is really interesting because there’s so much new technology today. And I’ve worked with a lot of companies and they’re really doing a similar thing, but they’re kind of pushing the boundary a little bit. And then we have these discussions like, well, are you going to redefine yourself as a new category? Which there’s a lot of education that comes into it and people aren’t searching for that necessarily. So how do you round the keywords there and how do you do that? But if you manage to attain that, then you’re right. You become the Airbnbs and the Ubers of the world.
Robin (03:08)
Yeah, it’s super interesting because before like during you know my MBA and so on before I was exposed to the blue ocean and red ocean strategy and I think that most of us have been exposed to that, the problem is that when you have a product It’s not all blue or red it’s really up to you to define and to craft your storytelling and your narrative to really be a bit like leaning toward the red or leaning toward the blue like
all things considered and all things equal, your messaging has an impact. And this is what I learned with this book, The Pirates and Playbigger. And the reason is you can frame the promised land, what your product, what your company will bring to your users, and frame the before and after state. And so it’s all about finding your point of view, what they say, the POV, to craft it. But again, it’s not
taken for granted that your product is either blue or red. It’s really what you make with it and how you craft category from your existing business.
Jason Niedle (04:05)
And I like this idea of framing the before and after state.
Robin (04:08)
Yeah, it’s really a toolkit. Of course, there are several examples within the book, but it’s also how they can give you a whole system, a lot of tactics and that you can apply. And in my previous position, I was leading the product at a company called Ogury. We were just to let you know, like to give you an idea, 500 within the company. And so it was already pretty mature. The product itself was like critical, like mobile advertising and
pretty mature, already like a unicorn and so on. And we welcomed a new CMO, Eli. Eli was an amazing guy and he was really fond of this book. He’s the one who kind of shared this book with me in the first place. And it was like amazing to see how in a couple of months we completely pivoted the messaging and the positioning of the company.
Everything was remaining the same, but it was so logical the way he framed the product we addressed and everything later became fluent. And so it’s a set of tools that you can apply whatever the maturity level of the company.
Jason Niedle (05:12)
I think I need to read that book because in the past year I’ve been looking at what we do. In the past we were a design shop and people would come here and say make a website and we’d make a website and we didn’t take responsibility for the results of that website, we just made the website. And then within the past year we’ve really switched our model to be growth partners where we we’ll make the website and we do those same services but we’re responsible for the results and so we’ll guarantee an ROI and your results are you want sales, you want leads,
It might be their job to close the sales, but it’s my job to deliver qualified leads now. And in some ways, we’re doing many of the same things that we’re doing. But in other ways, the messaging is completely different, the responsibility, the internal and external messaging is different. Yes, you’re going to do that same job, but now you’re just not like, it’s pretty, no, now it’s effective.
Robin (05:55)
Yeah.
And you need like all your touch points to be like super consistent. If your sales people, like your sales team is selling like from a different perspective than your overall overarching marketing concept and presentation and what they call POV, like again, like point of view, like on the category, then there is a mismatch. And so what you want to do is really to review all your collaterals from marketing to sales to customer success to product and so on to ensure that
the storytelling basically is consistent. And so it’s really like, don’t like to theoretical books because I feel that it’s always super hard to apply them on a daily basis. So it’s just like a mix of recipes and you can pick examples and recipes.
Jason Niedle (06:35)
Yeah.
I love that. Man, there’s so many things I could talk about here. We have a Photoshop tutorials company that we run and we don’t teach someone when we’re using Photoshop to say, here’s a tool, here’s how to select something and here’s how to do this and here’s how to do that. We don’t teach each tool. We look at it as a recipe-based learning and we say, okay, we want someone to be able to accomplish this particular path and now we’ll show them the tools they use it. And I always think about that. If I were going to a cooking class, I don’t want someone to say, here’s how to fry. I want them to say,
here’s how we make this dish.
Robin (07:09)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, or frame a problem. So what’s your problem when you try to cook or when you try to fry or whatever, and then the solutions, the promise and desire land, you really need to showcase a promise land that people will crave for it. And in terms of kind of small hacks, you don’t have to reinvent completely
Jason Niedle (07:25)
Mm.
Robin (07:30)
out of nowhere category keywords, you can take like an existing category and just put an adjective before to make it super appealing. For instance, transportation before Uber was like kind of broken with taxis and so on. And what they brought was instant local transportation or something like this. I don’t remember the exact term. You will read the book. But my point is, it’s really about how you can just with one single word frame
the context and the problem and the solution that you’re going to bring, even if it’s on a super like major category. For instance, CRM, Salesforce did this, is like, of course, super well-known example, but you had this on-premise super heavy like software system and they brought it with the SaaS and invented the SaaS. So this is kind of how we can frame your business.
Jason Niedle (08:18)
Good, so let’s talk about a recipe. Tell me how Claap is redefining categories.
Robin (08:23)
That’s a really good example and I think that, of course, this is what we try to do. First, as you mentioned during the introduction, we’ve been through a pivot and there is a before the pivot and an after. And so for us, we add a very consistent way to present ourselves in the beginning pre-pivot.
What we wanted to do was to create asynchronous meeting solutions. Back in 2021, we were in the middle of the lockdown and COVID situation and remote work was everywhere and everyone was just suffering in endless meetings all day long. And there was no real solution for asynchronous and remote solution beyond return format.
Of course, you could write long memos and emails. But what we wanted to do was really to bring this asynchronous way of working, but with video. And the category back in the days, we eventually pivoted because I think that the parent category was not Big enough, but it was Loom. You know, like the short video. Loom did a fantastic job. They created the record button of the internet. Just one click, you record super seamless. But the product depth and the promise was a bit broken.
Jason Niedle (09:13)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Robin (09:31)
Because when you wanted to make a decision and engage in a discussion, you needed to go in the Slack thread or in the email thread or even have a meeting. And so what we did with Claap was really to try to frame this asynchronous meeting desired land, where you can have a place to engage with your remote team, not in real meetings, but through videos, but that are really asynchronous powered with rich collaboration.
And so we did this before and after. Really like it was on our previous website. It was super clear. You had like this endless time in meetings or endless email threads that no one reads at one point. And then at the middle, we had like this desire language, which is Claap, and helping you to like collaborate in a more visual way and easy way. The problem that we faced is that
when you have a narrative and when your business evolves, and in our case, it was completely resided with the pivot, you create marketing and messaging depth. this was, I’m not sure it was addressed in the Playbigger book, but this is really something that we faced. Our brand was really strong, but we suffered because for a long time, we didn’t completely destroy the brand and
create a new brand and so we had to deal with this messaging depth and marketing depth to bring a new positioning and so this is what we are trying to do right now with our new like solution that you described in the introduction.
Jason Niedle (10:55)
Very interesting. Tell me a little bit more about the new solution and maybe about how that pivot happened.
Robin (11:01)
Yeah, so the pivot happened because we realized that the category, as I said, the parent category was not big enough. When you have a look at the like, Loom category, video messaging category, this is really like a subset and it didn’t really take off in spite of all what we could expect in 2021 and 2022. The second issue is our opportunity.
I would say is that we focused a lot. One of our main challenges was that we focused on product led growth [PLG]. We really like, took a bet about getting organic virality, a freemium model. We went all in on product led growth and PLG strategies. The problem that we faced is that it was kind of relying on gambling to scale the business. We had really good usage and engagement. Someone
Jason Niedle (11:51)
you
Robin (11:52)
could say vanity metrics. And we, at one point when we really started to monetize, we ended up realizing that even if we had some good successes and we managed to sign great clients, the problem was that it was really hard to create a repeatable business because you needed to have like organic variety. So first sign up within the company and then a cluster and so on and so on. And so,
Jason Niedle (12:08)
Hmm.
Robin (12:16)
One of the reasons we changed is, of course, the category itself was less dynamic than expected, but it’s also that we wanted to create a more repeatable business where we could really build a strong and healthy business plan. And you bring X in investment, you know that you’re going to get Y in ROI. And for this reason, we pivoted to a new positioning, a new category that I will explain quickly.
And we pivoted to a new system, like a new go-to-market motion, which is pairing product-led growths because it’s still good, I think, to bring in users and in-bounds, like product-qualified leads, but also sorry, a sales-led model where sales is really efficient to review visibility on your business. And what we do now is, yeah, the idea with Claap emerged from a pivot journey.
When we tried to adapt the business and establish this repeatable sales playbook, we discovered that there was no effective way to extract actionable insights from our customer conversations. And we are somehow drowning in meeting recordings, but we couldn’t access critical signals when needed. And so I heard in one of your last podcasts that you mentioned Fireflies, there are a lot of AI note takers. It’s a crowded category.
The problem is usually you’re going to get super polished and and crisp notes about the meeting. But if you really want to have insights at, the company level, getting like a view and patterns, identify patterns from all your recordings and all your voice of customer, it’s becoming a problem. And so this is what we try to do with Claap. We solve this very critical problem. Despite the current AI push, companies capture less than maybe 5% of the value
from the most valuable data source, which is customer conversations. What we want to do with Claap is create an open and flexible data platform that structures conversation data and makes it truly actionable. Maybe just to give you an illustration, if you think about Clay. Clay, you’re going to be able to enrich your leads with external data. Claap, you’re going to be able to do exactly the opposite, enrich your leads and prospects and so on,
but mining in all your data to create structured insights about all the discussion and voice of customer.
And from this, so if you think about a new offering, for instance, with your business, if you want to start a new offer or if you want to change your pricing and so on, so much happens. All business critical questions happen within like calls with clients and prospects. And so this is really a way to like get it, structure it and then make it actionable because we feed tools, integrations and AI agents.
Jason Niedle (14:47)
So I guess if I’m being honest here, I feel like that part of the story resonates far more with me, enrich from what, you know, learn more from what’s happening internally than reduce admin from sales calls. And I know there’s a lot of admin from sales calls, but hearing that part of the story of like, wow, I get this data that I never had before and I can really aggregate from my 15 sales people what’s really happening that, this one price product is too high or they’re not showing value there. Like that’s.
That’s mind blowing really.
Robin (15:15)
Thanks for the feedback, let’s be humble here. What I said about this messaging, you really illustrate the messaging and positioning depth. When we pivoted, we started with the basic meeting recorders such as Fireflies, and we wanted people to understand what we do. And now that we have a great product, we really want to build and elaborate on this POV.
Jason Niedle (15:32)
Mm, and that makes sense.
Robin (15:38)
And so what you can see on our marketing website and what you can see like on our official comm is something that we are currently like smoothly reinventing, to try to embrace this new category, which is a bit different. Of course, the product 50-60% is like Fireflies and other notetakers. But what we really want to do is to explain how we are different because it’s all about making this voice of customer structured, flexible and actionable.
Jason Niedle (15:46)
Mm.
Yeah, and by the way, I wasn’t saying that it wasn’t valuable, Like, absolutely reducing that admin is very valuable, but I got more excited when I heard the broader story.
Robin (16:06)
No, no, but…
And that’s point exactly that’s why I’m pretty happy with your remark because it’s really the same product, but you can frame it from different perspectives. And this is how you can build a product. And that’s why it’s not only about red ocean or blue ocean. It’s really about how you make your category and problem resonate. Now you feel the pain from what I said, and then you want a solution. Hopefully we’ll try to be the solution.
Jason Niedle (16:26)
Yeah.
Yeah, amazing. Well, and you know what? Other people, just because I felt one way doesn’t mean that bigger sales teams, right? They’re sales teams with hundreds of people and maybe they’re feeling that other pain point far more than I am, right, as well.
Robin (16:42)
Sure. What we do is we try to use Claap. We are the first customers of Claap. And so from all the interactions, we are still like in the early days, but we have 600 clients. We are growing the pipeline. And so we start to have like, insights and this goes in this direction. Now we need to polish. I’m not the marketing guy of the team. We have someone very good within the team, but we need to
Jason Niedle (16:53)
Mm.
Robin (17:06)
dig into all this data using Claap and come up with a great vision.
Jason Niedle (17:10)
Yeah, it’s so fun. It’s like a Rubik’s Cube where you have to solve this big puzzle. But I see how in a way you can be providing a solution that they haven’t seen before. Yeah.
Robin (17:19)
Exactly. And the problem
when you try to enter this, what I’ve seen in other companies and what I’ve seen with this, one of the risks is when you become too theoretical to try to invent a very niche problem for the sake of creating a problem and try to differentiate yourself for the sake of differentiation. But then you start finding problems that no one cares about. And so it’s all a question of balance. It’s great to be within a big category in us that people understand.
and you don’t want to always reinvent the wheel because otherwise you keep chasing ghosts
Jason Niedle (17:50)
Yeah. So let’s talk about growth really fast. Now that you’ve found product market fit, how are you looking to grow this year? What’s your KPI and where are you looking to skyrocket to?
Robin (18:00)
Yeah, at the moment, so one year ago, was early July 2024. We completely resided and relaunched the product. Now in nine months, we reach, as I said, 600 clients. We
worked on the product, to be honest, because when you have this vision, it’s great to have a good positioning and good narrative, but you need to have like something.
need to deliver and I’m the product guy of the team so it’s on my shoulders to deliver that product. And so most of the team today is really focusing on products and we only have one people focusing on sales for instance. So that’s really the early days and all the traction so far has been in kind of test and learn. The next phase for us will be to scale, go to market.
And this is going to go in two directions. What we want to do, if I give you like a quick roadmap, we didn’t completely give up on product led growth. We really feel, as I said before, that it’s a good way to attract people and to generate qualified leads. And so what we do is we have what we call low touch motion, which is fed by product led growth, organic variety, free trial and so on. And we have high touch motion. When we have like a lead
in our ICP, whether from outbound or from product-credified lead, we take it with our same theme that we’re going to hire. So we’re going to, in the next couple of months, scale these two motions, basically the low-touch motion and the high-touch motion.
Jason Niedle (19:27)
It’s interesting. saw, I was talking with someone who’s doing really well and later they showed me their Facebook ads. And I see these Facebook ads all the time, but they really went pretty far in pre-qualifying their leads. They said, you know, when are you looking to buy? How much are you looking to spend? And they had categories and they had like three questions. And I’m like, people are answering these questions? Cause to me it felt like it would be a huge barrier.
but they pre-qualified themselves and he took the people that answered half the questions the wrong way, that they weren’t an ICP and they just went to a different landing page, the low touch free trial kind of a thing. And then the other ones got sent to him and he said it’s costing him about $100 a lead, but his leads are worth five grand and he’s closing half of those. And so I’m like, 200 bucks a close at five grand, who cares? You do that all day long, right?
but it was interesting how he was willing to do things that I would have been resistant to do in that pre-qualification, but people are willing to do it. Are you finding ways to pre-qualify?
Robin (20:20)
Yeah, so at this stage we do stand out forms, but we have been testing for a couple of weeks, AI pre-qualification. When you book a demo, basically, as a prospect, or when we identify you as a product qualified lead, we’re going to research you, and it’s all by email to simplify.
But a bot is going to engage with you and ask so they already know you because we research the contact and the company. And also we have all the usage in case of product qualified lead about what you did in the product. And so we take all this knowledge to try to build like a discussion. We don’t hide that it’s a bot. It’s really like, hey, I’m here to really like explain how Claap works and make the most of the demo and so on. And so it’s more.
Jason Niedle (20:51)
Mm-hmm.
Robin (21:04)
in a discussion way and then we process all this to kind of fill the boxes that we need to qualify the customers and prospects but all this is done through like discussions, pre-demo discussions.
Jason Niedle (21:17)
I think that’s really smart. And I love that, of course, you’re using your own product and your own tools to make that happen because that has…
Robin (21:22)
Not only to
be honest, of course we do that, but as I said, we enrich, there is a lot of vibe coding and we really leverage everything that is out there at the moment. To send emails, to be reactive, to write and with the relevant mood and tone and so on. So of course there is like a backbone of what we learn is
Jason Niedle (21:31)
Yeah.
Robin (21:46)
coming from Claap, but it’s really also a lot of vibe codings around that to really bring consistent experience.
Jason Niedle (21:50)
Sure,
sure. So what’s holding you back from your growth goal, or not maybe holding you back, but what is holding you back from growing even faster internally? What’s your constraint?
Robin (22:02)
That’s a good question. I think that we need to come up with what we discussed, so our new positioning to really be clear on the foundations of what we do because at the moment we still have a lot of messaging depth from the previous business and from the early days of this new pivot.
Somehow we are super new in the business because it has been with the new business only nine months. So even if like the business is scaling like in a correct way, we are not mature at all. And so I think that when you want to scale, I like the concept of convexity. This is something that we try to apply internally. It’s laying the foundations that’s gonna help you to scale faster tomorrow.
Of course, we don’t want to completely forget about the YC advice and so on. But now that we have some foundations, really, instead of following a steady curve, we really want to have this convexity where we are ready to prepare the foundations for the future scale. And so this can take a lot of examples, but I was mentioning Vibe Coding and all what we do.
In order to nurture our inbound and outbound for instance, we get like a lot of acts to get people and we built internally with Lovable, a platform to qualify the leads and reach them and in one click send a message to them. So somehow it’s a mix of Clay, of Apollo, of all these tools. And it takes a while, but now that it is in place, it’s really making us
way more efficient at contacting people and getting people and leads within the funnel. And so my point is what’s preventing us at the moment, fixing the messaging and preparing the ground to really unlock this acquisition part. What we didn’t fix is automation of sales. And so it’s also, as I said, hiring people on basically sales reps. need to be
Jason Niedle (23:41)
Mm.
One thing at
one thing at a time.
Robin (23:50)
Even if
you need to build connection and human relationship, this is critical.
Jason Niedle (23:55)
Yeah, no, I mean, it’s always amazing how much there is to do. I think as a CEO and founder, you know, you might be great at product and then you get to learn the what another side of things and then you get and then the business changes and you get to figure out like, how do I level up as an individual and how do I learn what I need to learn to go to the next phase? And I think that’s always a really interesting part of all the things we talk about here, because most of the founders, they started somewhere and then they had to learn to be a CEO. And then there you get to a plateau and you got to learn how to get yourself through it.
Robin (24:23)
Yeah, I read something that I found pretty relevant. Every six months, you try to fire yourself, saying you try to see and imagine what would the company be like if you are not there. And so it’s a way for you to really break the dependency of the team and product and company around you. And you can really see the critical bottlenecks and then you try to fix it, whether it’s automation, delegation, hiring, whatever. And when you do it,
Jason Niedle (24:34)
Mm-hmm.
Robin (24:50)
Six months later you do it again and so it’s a way for you to go through all the different like functions and areas of the company and one after the other break or fix the bottlenecks that you represent
Jason Niedle (25:02)
Maybe that’s why yesterday on a podcast, I had someone bring that up to me he said, I try to reinvent myself every six months. So he must’ve read that.
Robin (25:08)
Not reinvent! — fire. It’s more… I fired myself on the product side. The team is almost autonomous on the product side. Now I’m more leaning toward go-to-market and I hope I’m going to be able to fire myself from go-to-market in the next couple of months.
Jason Niedle (25:10)
Fire.
Mm-mm.
Beautiful, I love that.
I think every company out there, especially tech leaders, they’re looking at AI. And I guess we could put this in a growth context. Like, how do we use these tools to grow? What should we be looking for?
Robin (25:37)
That’s a good question. For me, AI without any doubt is super transformative. There will be a before and after. And I think that my personal opinion, it’s no way similar to in terms of order of magnitude compared to the previous revolutions, whether it’s internet or industrial revolution and so on. For me, it’s going to be completely different,
the impact and so we need as leaders to have everyone within the company not afraid but embracing this trend. I really liked to this extent, maybe you’ve seen it, it made some noise, but the post from a Shopify CEO where he explained about how everyone at Shopify is really pushed.
And using AI is not considered as an option, but is really considered taken for granted as part of the role. Yeah. So I think that there is a question of internal management, internal operations. And so you need to check area by area. I mentioned about firing the CEO before, but it’s also firing human touch so that you can see on all individual workflows what can be done by AI.
Jason Niedle (26:23)
You better be using it every day, right?
Robin (26:42)
Now when it comes to the product, my feeling and what we want to do with Claap is we see great agents coming in, great capabilities, but the path toward AGI will be blocked if we don’t bring enough memory, brain and context to all these agents. And so this is part of what we believe is missing today and what we try to fix with Claap, at least on the voice of customer side.
Just to give you an analogy, you could get a McKinsey or any other tier one consultant to help you. But if you don’t give them all the context they need, they won’t be able to do much. And it’s as if today with AI agents, you need to give all the time, the context with each single individual interaction, giving the point, all what you need. And it’s not working. So my feeling is, I think that LLMs
Jason Niedle (27:25)
Mm, true.
Robin (27:30)
are really becoming powerful, but the next frontier and battle is bringing them with all the context they need to be fully efficient. And is not enough. I know that anyone talked about RAG, RAG is great, but RAG is not enough. That depends on the need, that depends on your use case. You really need to have different and other strategies to bring this context. Something else I’m really curious about at this stage is about the interconnection of all these tools and
we are still like bold about MCP. Whether it’s this protocol or another one, a protocol will come, a simple protocol will win, and that’s gonna really tie agents together. But the context, brain and memory is really like fundamental. Otherwise, we just have super powerful tier one consulting firm working for you without any context and brain.
Jason Niedle (27:57)
Yeah.
I think that’s the clearest way I’ve heard it stated on any of these 40 podcasts. So thank you for putting it in a little bundle right there. I love that. Any final thoughts? Anything else we forgot to talk about?
Robin (28:27)
I think it was super great. I was very happy to be invited because it’s always hard to talk about your challenging story when you grow. And usually you hear about success stories, but after they happened and not what’s blocking and preventing you to grow. And I could elaborate way more, but because that’s
what’s exciting on a daily basis, but I really like the angle of the podcast. So thanks for the discussion.
Jason Niedle (28:52)
No, I really appreciate being here and this has been great. I learned a lot. I’m definitely gonna look up the book as well and I’m gonna look into Claap myself, because I think it looks amazing. How can our audience find you?
Robin (29:03)
I’m posting a lot on LinkedIn, Robin Bonduelle with my French accent. for Claap, we have a Claap website. I’m sure you’re going to share it in the description. LinkedIn is our main medium to share news and updates.
Jason Niedle (29:17)
Perfect. And that website is claap.io. Claap, claap.io.
Robin (29:22)
Yeah, definitely. And if you have
trail runners listening to us, I’m a heavy runner on the UTMB format, I’m pretty happy as well to talk about trail if anyone is interested.
Jason Niedle (29:34)
Try to find those cool trail runner AI people out there.
Robin (29:37)
Yeah, I think that’s a great mix.
Jason Niedle (29:39)
Robin, thank you for being on Beyond SaaS. For tech leadership out there, we’re committed to exploring growth. So we drop episodes twice a week on Tuesdays and Thursdays. And you can find me, Jason Niedle, at tethos.com, t-e-t-h-o-s.com. And don’t forget to grab that hyperscale playbook at tethos.com/podcast. If you got some value today, I really appreciate sharing and questions and comments. So go ahead and leave those. That helps us out a lot. Until next time, this is Beyond SaaS.
